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About This Page: This is a discussion on Soccer within the LetsGoKings.com forums, at Los Angeles Kings Hockey Fan Forum. And NEW! WBC Superfeatherweight champion...
Congrats to both fighters for putting a great fight.
Biggest Sunday of the EPL ends with Man Utd beating Liverpool 3-0 and Chelsea completing an impressive comeback against Arsenal to beat them 2-1.
I would have liked to see that Arsenal game end in a draw, but if a team was going to win Chelsea is the team that I would have wanted to get the 3 points.
__________________ "11:19 -- You're not gonna believe this, but J.D. Drew took a called third strike to end the inning.
(Note: Dodgers, Braves and Cardinals fans everywhere are nodding and saying, "Yup ... been there, done that.")
I'd be pretty pissed too for getting a second yellow for just asking the ref why another player received a yellow. You sure showed the league you're tough now ref...
Torres was slightly harshly done by although asking the ref to book someone else is in itself a cardable offence hence his booking.
Mascherano on the other hand was booked for a bad tackle early which he responded to clearly by telling the referee to "***** Off" two or three times. He then spent the next twenty minutes chasing the referee around at every challenge running up to him and asking him to book other people and on at least two other occasions (those being the only ones I could see his mouth to lip read so there may have been more) telling him to "***** Off".
Then when Torres was booked he ran from twenty yards away to something that had nothing to do with him and started querying the ref, which in itself is dissent and was about the 6th time he'd done it. Bennett stood there and told him to go away, then asked him if he wanted to get sent off which Mascherano ignored and carried on complaining to. Hence he was sent off. He had every opportunity to walk away, every oppurtunity to stop behaving like a child and he neglected both. I personally would be disappointed if he doesnt get at least a couple more games ban for how he behaved after he was sent off incidentally.
The whole issue of dissent is that it is all about the constant querying of officials by these overpaid prats. The whole point is he DOESN'T have the right to ask the referee about his decisions. Only in football is this allowed and it needs to stop. There is a time and a place for it after the match in private.
And yes Ronaldo SHOULD have been booked for diving, Rio should have been booked earlier for kicking Torres about and all of that would have changed nothing as Man U were much much too good for Liverpool who under Benitez are only really interested in the Champions League it seems anyway as he doesn't have the guile to get his team to win the league.
Im a Newcastle fan and don't much like Man U at all incidentally
And Eboue should have been sent off in the Chelsea Arsenal game for dissent as well. The fact he wasn't doesnt make Mascherano one wrong it makes the Eboue one wrong
Then when Torres was booked he ran from twenty yards away to something that had nothing to do with him and started querying the ref, which in itself is dissent and was about the 6th time he'd done it. Bennett stood there and told him to go away, then asked him if he wanted to get sent off which Mascherano ignored and carried on complaining to. Hence he was sent off. He had every opportunity to walk away, every oppurtunity to stop behaving like a child and he neglected both. I personally would be disappointed if he doesnt get at least a couple more games ban for how he behaved after he was sent off incidentally.
Yea, that's the main thing, there was really no reason for Mascherano to run in and and join the discussion. Not sure what he was thinking there, I mean what is the point? Does he really need to know why Torres got a yellow card? He couldn't have asked Babel who was right there? There was zero reason for him to go over there and talk to the ref.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selmar
The whole issue of dissent is that it is all about the constant querying of officials by these overpaid prats. The whole point is he DOESN'T have the right to ask the referee about his decisions. Only in football is this allowed and it needs to stop. There is a time and a place for it after the match in private.
I'm personally pretty scared ****less about this dissent thing. With the amount of moaning Rooney does he's sure to get sent off for dissent at least once during the rest of the season!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selmar
And yes Ronaldo SHOULD have been booked for diving, Rio should have been booked earlier for kicking Torres about and all of that would have changed nothing as Man U were much much too good for Liverpool
Yup, pretty much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selmar
who under Benitez are only really interested in the Champions League it seems anyway as he doesn't have the guile to get his team to win the league.
Hmmm, I think Benitez does want to win the league, the team just isn't good enough. There is quality in the roster, as far as CMs go they have just as much talent as everybody. Adding Torres has helped their dearth of scoring in a big way but there's still no real secondary scoring threat up front. Gerrard is dangerous but to win the league you need at least 2 forwards who are threats or at the very least match winners on the wings(Chelsea when they won 2 for example). Liverpool doesn't have those threats. Things like that don't hurt you as much in a knockout tournament I think, especially if you play a defensive system which they do.
Anyways, Benitez could be out of a job if they don't win the Champions League. Harsh, I don't think he deserves to be fired or anything, but those owners seem itchy to make a move.
Mascherano is only 23 and will learn from this mistake. Just like Beckham's red card at the World Cup.
As for the captaincy, Gerrard is the best player on the team, but at the moment Mascherano and Jamie Carragher has the intangibles and the fitting personality to be leaders on the pitch.
They GIVE A **** about their team, they don't give a **** who they play against, and their body language shows their consistencies in that department. Gerrard earned his captains armband at a young age because he had that in him but I don't know what the **** happened. Gerrard has had many games in the last two seasons where he showed lacks of interest/intimidation/inferiority complex, etc, etc.
Aside from losing his cool which got him sent off against ManU, everything Mascherano has been doing for Liverpool, not just in the ManU game, IMO makes him the kind of leader this Liverpool team needs.
Last edited by redxalonso; March 25th, 2008 at 09:36 AM.
See if you'd said that about Mascherano last week I'd have agreed with you. He's just the lkind of player I'd like as a captain. It just seems you were linking him behaving like an idiot with making him captain. Of him and Tevez I'd have taken Mascherano every time and he's proving it this season. Quite what was going on at West Ham with him not being in their side makes the whole thing with them look even more fishy.
As for if this dissent thing kicks in Alan Smith (and thanks a LOT for selling us him and his no goals in 3 seasons useless self) won't last more than 30 seconds a game either. I think there is a groundswell of opinion for something to happen about it though in the UK. Fans are just sick of all the moaning whining and haranging of refs (and for that matter by the managers as well) and the players should have realised that after the Cole thing in midweek they'd have to be mad to talk to the ref as they were just looking for an example. N
As for Liverpool it's sad that they just aren't good enough as the league is frankly getting more and more boring. I think Benitez knows they aren't good enough which is why he seems content to just finish 4th and try and win a cup. But the thing is with the vast amount he's spent he should be challenging for the league. If I was the owners I'd look at the position in the league and think about how much I was spending and then think seriously about if he was making a good return on investment.
Benitez has done a great job rebuilding the academy, the reserve squad and the first team. He gutted the system and has paved the way for the club's future. It would be a travesty if he got fired.
Here's a look at the spine of the team in the 4-2-3-1 formation that Benitez prefers to play. For those of you who haven't seen Skrtel play, he has already pushed Jamie Carragher to RB on several occasions.
That spine is a young and elite group by any standard, depending on Gerrard's mood swings. At the moment, Kuyt is the RW and Babel is the LW. Babel is going to continue to be groomed as the future second striker for the 4-4-2.
Benitez needs two goal scoring wingers to optimize this formation and he has failed with Pennant, Benayoun, Kewell, and Mark Gonzalez. What's different this summer is, the depth is there for Liverpool, so Rafa can focus his warchest on just 2-3 players.
As for if this dissent thing kicks in Alan Smith (and thanks a LOT for selling us him and his no goals in 3 seasons useless self) won't last more than 30 seconds a game either. I think there is a groundswell of opinion for something to happen about it though in the UK. Fans are just sick of all the moaning whining and haranging of refs (and for that matter by the managers as well) and the players should have realised that after the Cole thing in midweek they'd have to be mad to talk to the ref as they were just looking for an example.
Agreed. IMO John Terry is the worst.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selmar
As for Liverpool it's sad that they just aren't good enough as the league is frankly getting more and more boring. I think Benitez knows they aren't good enough which is why he seems content to just finish 4th and try and win a cup. But the thing is with the vast amount he's spent he should be challenging for the league. If I was the owners I'd look at the position in the league and think about how much I was spending and then think seriously about if he was making a good return on investment.
Benitez's net spend hasn't changed in the last 4 seasons. People keep saying he has had a lot of money to spend, but a large some of the money came from sales of existing team members. He has had more to spend last summer, but the net spend was almost the same.
ManUnited bought Nani, Anderson, and Hargreaves without having to sell anyone. They spent 35 million pounds net on depth. Chelsea spends 30 million on Shevchenko who doesn't even play. Liverpool's net spend for last summer was only 25 million. .
Benitez is not content to finish 4th, but Rome wasn't built in day. He has made transfer mistakes but that's normal. The Liverpool team today is much better than the one he inherited 4 years ago. He knows what he needs and have told the owners loud and clear what it's going to take to catch up to Chelsea and ManUtd.
I've been trying to find somewhere to show me the net spend of teams in the Premership without that much luck All I can find is this
"(Since Benitez joined Liverpool)
Arse have a net spend of £5.4m PLUS
Chelsea with a net spend of £46.5m
Manu with a net spend of £66.1m
LPool with a net spend of £85.1m"
Which is from a message board and so I'm taking it very much with a pinch of salt but I would be interested to see some confirmed figures. It wouldnt really surprise me other than the Chelsea one which seems a bit low and if it is then Chelsea have got a lot better at getting Ambramovich's money out of Russia as time has gone on.........
John Terry is appalling with referees and should have been sent of many many times. I can remember him abusing Graham Poll last year then lying about it coming out in the media and selling all kinds of stories over what he claimed Poll said only for it all to be proved false because Polls mic picked up everything. Of course nothing happened to him because he was England captain. It made it all the funnier then when in midweek he was in the papers talking about the need to show more respect to referees and how he as a captain maybe should be the only one to talk to the ref to set and example........
Cheslea are apalling at chasing the ref. That's a legacy of your probably soon to be new manager Mourinho. Man U were just as bad at it 5 years ago and Arsenal inbetween. In fact Liverpool have in general not been that bad at harassing officials.
The problem with that side is it's a great set up for Champions league football. What he doesnt seem to be able to do is adapt it depending on the team in the league and when he does adapt he just tinkers around too much with players. Torres is your only really high class scorer (and I like Kuyt and am disappointed with him, Crouch is a flat track bully) and so you need him playing most of the time not resting him every other game. It's no coincidence your form picked up when he stopped dropping him all the time.
Anyway i should go back to concentrating on my own teams horrible position.... Ive decided to join the other half of my family in supporting Carlisle United as we might well be playing them next year. Although the Fulham win was I think totally vital. We were down if we didn't win that
All I can find is this