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About This Page: This is a discussion on NHL Talk within the LetsGoKings.com forums, at Los Angeles Kings Hockey Fan Forum. Courtesy of PuckMonkey
the reason i dont like the singing of the national anthem at professional sporting events, that are not international events, has everything to do with the content of this thread.
the reason i dont like it is that it drums up superficial, irrational, baseless forms of nationalism that ultimately will always try to silence dissent, discourage difference, and stifle progress.
a reasonable question is asked about the singing of the national anthem and it turns into an immediate knee jerk reaction in defense of the NATION.
the national anthem has absolutely nothing at all to do with the nhl, hockey, or any other sport.
doc is not the first nor will he be the last person to ask the why we play the national anthem at professional sporting events, and whether or not we should.
op is not the only person nor will he be the last to hijack that discussion and turn it into a nationalist pissing contest where two or more groups measure the color and content of their patriotic schlongs
the reason i do not care for the singing of the national anthem at hockey games is because i have an inquisitive mind, because i elect to think critically and practice my civic responsibility of not taking things for granted, i must incessantly produce my nationalistic bona fides before participating in any rational discussion.
finally to the nitwit who stated "All of them from liberals no doubt. Certainly no founding father or philosopher said those things. Probably just more junk from the liberal media" i hope you were being sarcastic. if not, let me just say that our nation was founded on liberal ideals. there is no contradiction between liberalism and conservatism. they are perfectly compatible and not opposites because conservatism is a degree of belief, whereas liberalism is a particular political philosophy rooted in the enlightenment. the principals of personal freedom and liberty are the cornerstone of liberal thought that emerged during that period, and codified in our constitution and bill of rights. that we all possess rights granted by god, that no government can infringe upon is the definition of liberalism. read a book, you just might find you may learn something. though, judging from the tone of most of the folks who are participating in this thread, learning something new is just not a high priority.
the reason i dont like the singing of the national anthem at professional sporting events, that are not international events, has everything to do with the content of this thread.
the reason i dont like it is that it drums up superficial, irrational, baseless forms of nationalism that ultimately will always try to silence dissent, discourage difference, and stifle progress.
a reasonable question is asked about the singing of the national anthem and it turns into an immediate knee jerk reaction in defense of the NATION.
the national anthem has absolutely nothing at all to do with the nhl, hockey, or any other sport.
doc is not the first nor will he be the last person to ask the why we play the national anthem at professional sporting events, and whether or not we should.
op is not the only person nor will he be the last to hijack that discussion and turn it into a nationalist pissing contest where two or more groups measure the color and content of their patriotic schlongs
the reason i do not care for the singing of the national anthem at hockey games is because i have an inquisitive mind, because i elect to think critically and practice my civic responsibility of not taking things for granted, i must incessantly produce my nationalistic bona fides before participating in any rational discussion.
finally to the nitwit who stated "All of them from liberals no doubt. Certainly no founding father or philosopher said those things. Probably just more junk from the liberal media" i hope you were being sarcastic. if not, let me just say that our nation was founded on liberal ideals. there is no contradiction between liberalism and conservatism. they are perfectly compatible and not opposites because conservatism is a degree of belief, whereas liberalism is a particular political philosophy rooted in the enlightenment. the principals of personal freedom and liberty are the cornerstone of liberal thought that emerged during that period, and codified in our constitution and bill of rights. that we all possess rights granted by god, that no government can infringe upon is the definition of liberalism. read a book, you just might find you may learn something. though, judging from the tone of most of the folks who are participating in this thread, learning something new is just not a high priority.
More irony: People like this complaining about the tone of others here. Did somebody say condesending?
And if you think that the National Anthem discourages difference and stiffles progress, I think you're pretty off base.
If this song is so superficial, irrational, and baseless, then why does it bother you so much? Is it so bad that people take a moment to look at the flag and listen to a song that respresents the sacrifices people made in order to give you, and anyone from any other country who is here legally (thus avoiding the trebuchet), the right to Opportunity and Freedom?
Now, if you believe ceremonies of any sort are useless and baseless, then that's where we disagree, and so be it. If you think that they have a purpose, why not this one?
__________________ -Fish
"When you can't run anymore you crawl, and when you can't crawl, when you can't do that..."
Karma to whomever can finish that.
Yes, because I think people marching around and disrupting people is annoying and does more harm than good for a cause, I hate the Bill of Rights and the 1st Ammendment.
Nowadays, there are much better ways to get people's attention. Far more production comes from blogs and online activity than from standing on a street corner holding signs that say "No War." You know why people are honking? They already agree with you. Nobody changes their mind because of these things.
You're right, nothing ever comes of these things. Women's suffrage, end of the Vietnam war, The Civil Rights Act - all because of blogs which are read by maybe 3% of the general population.
__________________ Immorality: the morality of those who are having a better time.
You're right, nothing ever comes of these things. Women's suffrage, end of the Vietnam war, The Civil Rights Act - all because of blogs which are read by maybe 3% of the general population.
If you actaully read the point of my arguement, maybe you'd have a legit. response. But you ignored the fact that what I was pointing out is that there are better ways because, yes, 3% of the 300 million in this country alone (which is 9 million people, btw) is going to get a better response than the few thousnad (if that) that drive by the road you're marching on. Plus, pissing people off is no way to help your cause.
You do understand 9 million is more than a few thousand, right?
Last edited by FishMonger; April 29th, 2008 at 03:01 PM.
How fitting: The tone of some of you (i.e. Gollum and Maddogg) is the tone of those in those mobs (yes, they are mobs). They have the mentality of 'we're right, everyone else is wrong, and we're not listening to anyone.' This is not productive because the mob metality, which you people have, does not allow for independent, or even rational, thought.
...
This is why I hate people who protest in mobs. I'm sure you're all intelligent people. When you jump on a bandwagon, it's no longer apparent.
2) How do you mean?
I do find some of them pretty, especially the gigantic Mormon one in SD. Very impressive, though I don't think that's what you're looking for.
2) How do you mean?
I do find some of them pretty, especially the gigantic Mormon one in SD. Very impressive, though I don't think that's what you're looking for.
I don't mean the buildings, I mean the organizations.
After reading your post about mob mentality and all that, I thought it'd be fun to hear (err, read) what you think of them.
__________________ I'm not even supposed to be here today!
I don't mean the buildings, I mean the organizations.
After reading your post about mob mentality and all that, I thought it'd be fun to hear (err, read) what you think of them.
In the interest of keeping the thread at least partially on topic, I'm going to have to refrain from responding directly. Feel free to start a "How FishMonger Feels About Churches" thread, though.
That would be amusing.
In the interest of keeping the thread at least partially on topic, I'm going to have to refrain from responding directly. Feel free to start a "How FishMonger Feels About Churches" thread, though.
That would be amusing.
In the interest of keeping the thread at least partially on topic, I'm going to have to refrain from responding directly. Feel free to start a "How FishMonger Feels About Churches" thread, though.
That would be amusing.
More irony: People like this complaining about the tone of others here. Did somebody say condesending?
And if you think that the National Anthem discourages difference and stiffles progress, I think you're pretty off base.
If this song is so superficial, irrational, and baseless, then why does it bother you so much? Is it so bad that people take a moment to look at the flag and listen to a song that respresents the sacrifices people made in order to give you, and anyone from any other country who is here legally (thus avoiding the trebuchet), the right to Opportunity and Freedom?
Now, if you believe ceremonies of any sort are useless and baseless, then that's where we disagree, and so be it. If you think that they have a purpose, why not this one?
first, i never complained about the "tone" of others here.
second, its too bad that you think that i am off base here. had you actually came up with some reasons behind your opinion i could probably engage you in an important and frutiful conversation. but since that doesnt appear to be yours or others on this boards cup of tea...
and you didnt read the post or you missed the point altogether. the national anthem is superficial and irrational (i will get to that point later), but its the feelings that are evoked when it is played at sporting event that i said evoked superficial feelings. there really is no context other than, "well thats just what we have done for so long," which is, lets be honest, a pretty silly reason to do anything. we are talking here about the PLAYING and/or SINGING of the national anthem, not the anthem itself. got it? are you still with me?
yea i am now being condescending. because you seem to be having a very very hard time with reading comprehension. but dont worry you dont seem to be the only one. so let me try to spell this out another way.
playing/singing national anthem at pro sports matches serves no true purpose most of the time
because: it has no true context at a sporting event
the teams playing have nothing to do with the anthem, nor does the sport, nor do the fans
it evokes shallow feelings which become concrete (that means real) only when someone asks a perfectly RATIONAL (that means reasonable, and under normal circumstance, that means when someone actually uses their brain for something other than simply feeding their gob or humping something, what anyone would or could consider) question.
as a result, the person who asks the question becomes vilified (that means, told to go back to their country and stupid crap like that) which in turn results in the aforementioned pissing contest.
finally, and this will really blow your mind, the anthem is superficial. all symbols are. its only people that add depth of feeling to anything we might call symbolic. its only when i elect to go into a particular bathroom that the meaning of the male female symbols take shape. thats why the playing of the anthem at pro sporting events is superficial, because it takes a song to which we assign patriotic passion and nationalistic pride, and places it in an arena (no pun intended) that has absolutely nothing to do with either.
first, i never complained about the "tone" of others here.
second, its too bad that you think that i am off base here. had you actually came up with some reasons behind your opinion i could probably engage you in an important and frutiful conversation. but since that doesnt appear to be yours or others on this boards cup of tea...
and you didnt read the post or you missed the point altogether. the national anthem is superficial and irrational (i will get to that point later), but its the feelings that are evoked when it is played at sporting event that i said evoked superficial feelings. there really is no context other than, "well thats just what we have done for so long," which is, lets be honest, a pretty silly reason to do anything. we are talking here about the PLAYING and/or SINGING of the national anthem, not the anthem itself. got it? are you still with me?
yea i am now being condescending. because you seem to be having a very very hard time with reading comprehension. but dont worry you dont seem to be the only one. so let me try to spell this out another way.
playing/singing national anthem at pro sports matches serves no true purpose most of the time
because: it has no true context at a sporting event
the teams playing have nothing to do with the anthem, nor does the sport, nor do the fans
it evokes shallow feelings which become concrete (that means real) only when someone asks a perfectly RATIONAL (that means reasonable, and under normal circumstance, that means when someone actually uses their brain for something other than simply feeding their gob or humping something, what anyone would or could consider) question.
as a result, the person who asks the question becomes vilified (that means, told to go back to their country and stupid crap like that) which in turn results in the aforementioned pissing contest.
finally, and this will really blow your mind, the anthem is superficial. all symbols are. its only people that add depth of feeling to anything we might call symbolic. its only when i elect to go into a particular bathroom that the meaning of the male female symbols take shape. thats why the playing of the anthem at pro sporting events is superficial, because it takes a song to which we assign patriotic passion and nationalistic pride, and places it in an arena (no pun intended) that has absolutely nothing to do with either.
I'm going to be honest here... you bore the heck outta me, and you have no credibility. Here's why:
Your first sentence is wrong. You did mention tone before, in the post I quoted in fact, but you can't seem to remember what you wrote. I don't want to bother arguing with someone who can't even remember what they're saying.
Moreover, you just say the same thing over and over. I
Goallum
