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About This Page: This is a discussion on LA Kings Talk within the LetsGoKings.com forums, at Los Angeles Kings Hockey Fan Forum. o noes! is this gonna be another lawyer pissthread??
I sure hope so!!
Not gonna lie, I skipped page 2, but what I've read minus a few posters is slightly absurd.
I know losing out on a pick/prospect sucks, but whatever, get over your ****. This team has picks and prospects. Blake wants to stay in LA during its rebuild. Everything players/coaches/owners say about Blake is positive, so obviously he's responsible for things beyond what us fans can see solely on gameday. He is not single handedly responsible for the inconsistency that is youth and to say as much is quite frankly unfair. How about we stop bitching about Blake not waiving the NTC and instead thank him for showing the youth loyalty from the team. And if you're in the boat that feels he's not loyal because the Colorado debacle, then I'm not making excuses for him, but maybe he left got his trophy and is coming back to share that knowledge with LA.
We have no idea what's truth vs. rumor, so maybe for once LGK should try an optimistic stance and give someone the benefit of the doubt.
but then again it's LGK and the chance of that happening is slim to none
My reaction will have absolutely nothing to do with Colorado and abdicating the captaincy. I say will have because in light of what his comments have been as far as having the teams long term interests at heart and wanting to employed by the Kings after he hangs up the skates, my opinion depends upon what type of condition he places on waiving the NTC or if he does it at all. Remember that he is UFA after the season and there is likely no reason why he can't come back next year and continue to "share his knowedge".
If he isn't willing to waive the NTC or limits it to so few teams as to make it unprofitable for the Kings he is essentially saying that he is unwilling to "sacrifice" a couple of months of playing for a contender which would improve a future version of the Kings, whom he has said he would like to both play for after the season and be employed by someday. If he chooses this path of resistance to a trade, based upon his own comments, I will have issue with him.
Except, by court standards, this isn't hearsay. Hearsay would be if Chelios told me this personally, then I said, "Chelios told me that Blake said..." It's not hearsay when Chelios says, "Blake told me..."
i and my juris doctorate disagree.
as does federal rule of evidence 802(c): "'Hearsay' is a statement, other than one made by the declarant while testifying at the trial or hearing, offered in evidence to prove the truth of the matter asserted."
hearsay is when a witness (chelios) says someone else (blake) said something to them ("i'd love to go to detroit") and asserts that any such statement is true (blake would love to go to detroit).
in this case, it's double-hearsay, because you are saying that because chelios said that blake said it, it's true. so you're wrong not once, but twice.
so now we've established a few things:
1) you don't know if blake ever had that conversation with chelios.
2) you don't know, if in fact the conversation did take place, whether blake said he'd love to go to detroit.
3) you don't know, if in fact the conversation took place and blake said he'd love to go to detroit, that he meant it.
4) you don't know the rule on hearsay.
i think i made it pretty clear that i don't know whether blake said anything to anybody about going to detroit.
as does federal rule of evidence 802(c): "'Hearsay' is a statement, other than one made by the declarant while testifying at the trial or hearing, offered in evidence to prove the truth of the matter asserted."
hearsay is when a witness (chelios) says someone else (blake) said something to them ("i'd love to go to detroit") and asserts that any such statement is true (blake would love to go to detroit).
in this case, it's double-hearsay, because you are saying that because chelios said that blake said it, it's true. so you're wrong not once, but twice.
so now we've established a few things:
1) you don't know if blake ever had that conversation with chelios.
2) you don't know, if in fact the conversation did take place, whether blake said he'd love to go to detroit.
3) you don't know, if in fact the conversation took place and blake said he'd love to go to detroit, that he meant it.
4) you don't know the rule on hearsay.
i think i made it pretty clear that i don't know whether blake said anything to anybody about going to detroit.
and neither do you.
Well, it appears that Blake is the one we're trying here, and my juris doctorate says that Chelios' statement comes in as evidence under the party admission exception.
Well, it appears that Blake is the one we're trying here, and my juris doctorate says that Chelios' statement comes in as evidence under the party admission exception.
that only applies if the declarant is unavailable....
but you have excited utterance.... or existing mental state.... or any number of other exceptions that define the hearsay rule.
my point is, just because chelios said blake said, doesn't mean that he did, or that it's true even if he did say it.
Last edited by 4/10/82; February 19th, 2008 at 11:10 AM.
- He gets $12 million to suck for 3/4 of his contract. He literally only started turning things around in December
Whatever -- that's your opinion. Last season, he wasn't great, but wasn't that bad considering the team that was around him. This season, he wasn't 100% until December. Regardless, your anger is misplaced. Lombardi signed him for $6M/Y, so if you don't like the amount, blame Dean.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
- He told Chelios he wants to play with the Red Wings... not that he wants to go to a contender... that he wants to play with the Red Wings. That weeds out potential buyers and lowers his trade value to the Wings, since they would appear to be the only team he wants to play for
- He acts like a bitch in the Denver Post, with this negative attitude at a team wanting to trade him.
- He wants to see this "rebuild" through for 2, 3, 4, 5 years... but says he wants to remain a King; so he doesn't want to get traded and help contribute to this rebuild by acquiring assets.
- Save for point 1, all the points include talking, talking, talking. He doesn't keep his mouth shut, and always says the wrong thing at the worst time.
No, it's just people like you scouring every word of his interviews, looking for any opportunity to crack back on him for any little slight, whether the slight is real or imagined. Facts of the matter are that he's going to be involved in trade rumours, and that the media is going to ask him questions over and over again. I don't expect Blake to say "no comment" over and over and I don't have a problem with him speaking honestly. This whole "OMG B-b-b-but Chelios said!!!" ... it's just ridiculous. It sounds like a fourth grader snitching on a classmate to the teacher.
And just FYI, when a player says he wants to see something through, that means he wants to stay here and actually see it through. Again, this hysteria over finding some "hidden meaning" in his statements is WAY over the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
It's not really rocket science with how this works.
- When those big name UFAs near the deadline on a last place team, they BEST serve their team by being traded. For a few months.
If the scenario you're describing is so common, give me a few examples of when it's happened. I mean, it isn't rocket science, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
I've kept my mouth shut and not imbibed on the Blake haterade this season until Blake started this BS. Once he takes one for the team (considering the Kings gave him $12 million, I don't think relocating for a couple months is unreasonable), he'll be okay again in my book. Until then, **** him.
The only BS in this whole scenario is in the minds of people like you who couldn't wait to find something to hammer on Blake about. Lombardi hasn't even ASKED Blake to waive his NTC, so what that tells me is that the Kings haven't received any worthy offers at this point. How is this Blake's fault?
If Lombardi DOES end up getting a great offer right before the deadline, asks Blake about it, and Blake refuses to go -- then I would see your point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King'sPawn
So because we have an opinion that he's a piece of ****, we're not Kings fans?
Well, you're reaching here, but I WILL say that it isn't hard to discredit that opinion when it isn't based on anything. It's not based on any evidence, it's completely based on misinformation and imagination. But, whatever, have fun with it.
RockPile
