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About This Page: This is a discussion on Computers/Tech/Photo within the LetsGoKings.com forums, at Los Angeles Kings Hockey Fan Forum. Originally Posted by Iron Duke
This kind of crap annoys me. Most of your Average Joe consumers are pefectly content with DVD as the standard format, and I believe a
This kind of crap annoys me. Most of your Average Joe consumers are pefectly content with DVD as the standard format, and I believe a good portion would rather stay with that as the stable standard, then be asked to invest in an offshoot technology that may, or more likely may not be the standard in another 3-4 years. Do both formats improve upon DVD technology? Absolutely. Do they change the technology to an appreciable enough degree to warrant customers going out and buying into it? I don't believe so.
For conviences purposes, you're correct. Visually, however, you couldn't be more wrong. With the correct hardware (easily available, and soon to be mandatory) and a properly prepared disc, the technical upgrade is greater than VHS to DVD. I've had a number of people walk away from my house completely shocked at how much nicer HD media looks than SD-DVD, even after unconverting.
I said vertical monopoly. Not a monopoly in the sense you are saying.
They are the only company in the world that controls electronic players and the media in the way they do.
Toshiba doesn't own media. Microsoft doesn't own media.
HP also has HD-DVD ROM players. You can say they all are rebadged or manufactured by Toshiba. But those companies have put out players with their name on it.
You fault Toshiba in lowering the price of their players to make it hard for others to compete, but say nothing about Sony and their PS3, which is obvious to everyone is a loss leader.
Movies? I'd love for you to show me the monopoly that Sony has on Blu-ray movies.
Video games? Again . . . same as above.
Players? You mention RCA (who has abandoned HD-DVD already), and MICROSOFT? You know that Toshiba manufactures the 360 Add-on, right? LG has NOT manufactured an HD-DVD player, that's a flat out lie. They developed a Blu-ray player that was adapted to be able to play HD-DVD discs. It did not meet the specs to be able to carry the HD-DVD logo, however.
And I'm still not sure how you can claim that Sony has a monopoly on players while in the same post mentioned other CE companies (direct competitors of Sony) who manufacture players.
With all due respect, I think it's pretty clear you fall into the "Sony = evil" crowd.
I may be incorrect, but I read his post more as stating that Sony had its hand in every stage of the business, and had a diversity of product to use on the medium, not that it had a literal monopoly. Bah, go just clarified it...
BD+ Technologies Launches Content Protection Licensing Program
LOS ANGELES, Calif. June --, 2007 -- BD+ Technologies, LLC, the licensor of BD+, the exclusive added layer of content protection for movies and other premium entertainment released on the Blu-ray Disc standard, announced today the completion of its licensing program.
The program includes the BD+ Specifications and Agreement for BD+ Adopters (Player/Chip Manufacturers), as well as BD+ Content Participants and authorized BD+ code developers.
Key points from two BR supporters that have been rumored to be holding off more releases until BD+ was complete...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Dunn, President - Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment, Worldwide
Fox has vigorously fought against piracy for years and the adoption of BD+ as part of the Blu-ray Disc specification, and an enhancement over and above AACS, was a key factor in our decision to publish on the format. This added layer of content protection gives Blu-ray yet another distinct competitive advantage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Doctorow, MGM Home Entertainment, General Manager
This is great news for the market. Content providers can release more product knowing there is stronger copy protection - and for consumers that translates into a greater choice of films.
Oh, and Adobe announced authoring and burning support for Blu-ray with Encore CS3 due out next month. Here is a walk through tutorial (if you care to look):
For conviences purposes, you're correct. Visually, however, you couldn't be more wrong. With the correct hardware (easily available, and soon to be mandatory) and a properly prepared disc, the technical upgrade is greater than VHS to DVD. I've had a number of people walk away from my house completely shocked at how much nicer HD media looks than SD-DVD, even after unconverting.
Bleh, missed this one the other day, sorry for the late reply. I have no doubt that this is true, I am sure that the new technology is a significant increase in quality over the old formats. I am just not sure with the amount of money that has been invested in pushing the DVD format to its current position over VHS, and with the availability of downloadable, non-disc media just around the corner, that it is ever going to gain enough of a foothold to become the new standard.
HD-DVD and BR sounds more like a push from the major movie companies to retain a degree of control in the home movie market (the type that music companies are possessing less and less of) through having a share in the production and distribution phases, and to force a final cycle of media buying from collectors before optical media goes to its grave for good.
Bleh, missed this one the other day, sorry for the late reply. I have no doubt that this is true, I am sure that the new technology is a significant increase in quality over the old formats. I am just not sure with the amount of money that has been invested in pushing the DVD format to its current position over VHS, and with the availability of downloadable, non-disc media just around the corner, that it is ever going to gain enough of a foothold to become the new standard.
HD-DVD and BR sounds more like a push from the major movie companies to retain a degree of control in the home movie market (the type that music companies are possessing less and less of) through having a share in the production and distribution phases, and to force a final cycle of media buying from collectors before optical media goes to its grave for good.
But if the titles that are in demand are created by these very studios, how can you suggest they'll send optical media "to it's grave for good?"
But if the titles that are in demand are created by these very studios, how can you suggest they'll send optical media "to it's grave for good?"
I'm not suggesting the movie studios are attempting to do that, I very much doubt that is in their best interests. My post didn't state that.
I was more arguing that HD-DVD/Blu-Ray may be a final money grab for the movie studios before they lose the production profits that DVD media currently nets them, as the technological market is taking us away from all forms of hard copy media in favor of portable mass storage and downloadable content. In essence, trying to delay the trend that has already occurred in the music industry.
Sure, they possess the rights to the movies that are most in demand, but if they attempt to stay with these "niche" technologies when the online movie market goes live, they're prone to lose a lot of money. As a sort of parallel, look at the PC market right now. Microsoft is releasing Vista-only software titles in an effort to drive more households into running Vista. Is it working? No, the titles are tanking, relatively speaking. This is the same type of situation I foresee here.
Last edited by Iron Duke; June 29th, 2007 at 09:22 PM.
I'm not suggesting the movie studios are attempting to do that, I very much doubt that is in their best interests. My post didn't state that.
I was more arguing that HD-DVD/Blu-Ray may be a final money grab for the movie studios before they lose the production profits that DVD media currently nets them, as the technological market is taking us away from all forms of hard copy media in favor of portable mass storage and downloadable content. In essence, trying to delay the trend that has already occurred in the music industry.
Sure, they possess the rights to the movies that are most in demand, but if they attempt to stay with these "niche" technologies when the online movie market goes live, they're prone to lose a lot of money. As a sort of parallel, look at the PC market right now. Microsoft is releasing Vista-only software titles in an effort to drive more households into running Vista. Is it working? No, the titles are tanking, relatively speaking. This is the same type of situation I foresee here.
They make too much money from physical media. They're finding THAT out with their own ventures in the music industry. (They're screaming at Jobs for more money from iTunes sales, and still, physical media at Best Buy and Walmart are outselling a download music service.)
But it's quite a huge difference from downloading an album in 10 minutes, as opposed to a 2 hour HD title taking several hours. And then it's only a rental.
The European Commission, the European Union's executive body, appears to be particularly interested in the activities of the Blu-ray group because of its dominance in Hollywood, according to people familiar with the situation. The commission is investigating whether improper tactics were used to suppress competition and persuade the studios to back their format.
Just saw Casino Royale in Blu-Ray and it was the Shiz. Looking forward to getting a chance to watch HD-DVD so I make a good comparison.
BTW, any of you guys think there is a chance that BOTH formats will be around and most people will just opt to buy a hybrid player?
I doubt it. I don't think the format goes anywhere until there is a winner. This holiday season should kill HD-DVD, because they are going to be selling cheap players to people who are going to be shocked and pissed that they can't get the majority of movies they want to see.
The HD DVD camp has been lobbying the commission to draw attention to Blu-ray's tactics in the movie capital in a bid to force more studios to put their product on HD DVD, according to people familiar with the situation.
So all of this was done at the bequest of the HD-DVD camp. Sounds an awful lot like sour grapes.
I think it's pretty clear that it isn't backroom deals that has certain studios backing Blu-ray. Disney has stated time and time again that they want the format with the most space. Fox has stated they want the format with the most protection of their property - something that they proved by pulling ALL Blu-ray releases after HD-DVD was hacked and are still waiting for BD+ to be available.
Sorry, dude, but the real stink in backroom relationships HAS to be Universal and HD-DVD. Think about it, they have chosen a format that is losing the war by a 30 to 70 margin, and are pumping out lame catalog titles without any effort to make them genuinely impressive. Warner and Paramount prove that studios have the right to make discs on both formats.
The monopoly in this war still exists with Toshiba, IMO.
Thanks for posting that article, though. It does give me the idea that HD-DVD is starting to really see the writing on the wall and is getting desparate in order to save their investment.
BTW . . . HD-DVD is taking an absolute POUNDING in Europe. It's really not much of a war at all at this point.
Last edited by dgrycan; July 3rd, 2007 at 10:47 PM.
Iron Duke
