A must read if you care about our veterans

[irisher]

Foreign Policy In Focus | The Truth About Veteran Suicides

[KingsJohn/Obediah]

This is the hidden cost of war and unfortunately vets repeatedly get hosed by the government. The fact that there wasn't a bigger hoo-hah about Walter Reed still astounds me.

[OddManRush]

Originally Posted by KingsJohn/Obediah

This is the hidden cost of war and unfortunately vets repeatedly get hosed by the government. The fact that there wasn't a bigger hoo-hah about Walter Reed still astounds me.

Likewise here. And it further astounds me that McCain and the Pentagon are against expanding the GI Bill to offer better educational benefits to returning vets when it is clear to me that at least part of this epidemic of suicides among soldiers is due to limited options after returning from deployment.

ABC News: McCain, Military Oppose Expanding GI Bill

[SmytheKing]

Originally Posted by OddManRush

Likewise here. And it further astounds me that McCain and the Pentagon are against expanding the GI Bill to offer better educational benefits to returning vets when it is clear to me that at least part of this epidemic of suicides among soldiers is due to limited options after returning from deployment.

ABC News: McCain, Military Oppose Expanding GI Bill

Yes. He completely opposes expanding the GI Bill.

[OddManRush]

Originally Posted by SmytheKing

Yes. He completely opposes expanding the GI Bill.

From your article:

Graham’s plan would give $2,000 in monthly benefits to veterans who have served 12 years or longer.

The Webb plan, modeled after the GI Bill from World War II, would ensure that veterans receive educational benefits for 36 months, including the full cost of tuition, the cost of purchasing books and a monthly stipend. But some Republicans have objected to the cost and scope of the measure.

Graham and McCain to soldiers contemplating suicide: "Hang in there guys, only 7 more years to go!"

[SmytheKing]

Originally Posted by OddManRush

From your article:



Graham and McCain to soldiers contemplating suicide: "Hang in there guys, only 7 more years to go!"

So you don't think his critique that the Webb bill will encourage people to leave the military quicker holds any water I presume? You don't think there is any credence to the idea that you want people signing up for the military because they want to serve rather than get benefits?

[dgrycan]

Originally Posted by SmytheKing

So you don't think his critique that the Webb bill will encourage people to leave the military quicker holds any water I presume? You don't think there is any credence to the idea that you want people signing up for the military because they want to serve rather than get benefits?

Wait a minute - so the promise of a great education, fun adventures all over the world and cash incentives are good on the front end but not the back end?

People should NOT have to serve for 12 years during a time of war in order to receive benefits from our government. Anyone who voluntarily completes one tour in my books deserve everything we can give them.

Seriously - isn't three years a long time to serve considering the time invested and the risk involved?

[Joe Hoya]

Originally Posted by SmytheKing

You don't think there is any credence to the idea that you want people signing up for the military because they want to serve rather than get benefits?

Can't it be both?

[KingsJohn/Obediah]

Originally Posted by Joe Hoya

Can't it be both?

Agreed

Smythe IMO asking anyone to do 12 years, i.e. multiple combat re-enlistments is nuts. Maybe a 12 years(for non combat MOS') or x number of tours fro combat MOS

[jom]

Here's an idea : A little less money spent on foreign wars and a little more for our Vets. Seems simple to me. I don't understand how the govt can pay private contracts at "no bid" for work in Iraq and have the "Walter Reed" type problems here at home. A ****ing abomination....

Back in the day the GI Bill gave money to Vets to help them buy homes. In fact, my uncle (mom's younger brother) gave his to my dad so he could buy the home I grew up in in Westminster. Dad later paid him back but to me that seemed like a great benefit to my uncle. Maybe that's how it is now but with housing costs I would doubt it...

jom

[Bubbadel2]

Im using my GI Bill and I know it wont cover me getting my degree. I will still have to take out loans. And there is no way in hell that people will sign up for longer just to get the GI Bill.

[Unruely35]

Im probably gonna go a little to the left field on this comment, but bare with me.

I dont understand why anyone here would question benefits for the men and women who put themselves in a position of danger to defend the ideals of the country you enjoy life in. Every single person that serves any length of time should be given every opportunity to a career after the military an adjust back to a 'normal' life. Looking at it on paper says nothing for what actually happens to these people.

So you don't think his critique that the Webb bill will encourage people to leave the military quicker holds any water I presume? You don't think there is any credence to the idea that you want people signing up for the military because they want to serve rather than get benefits?

I think if you believe kids in a time of war knowing what their most likely destination is would join the military just for the 'perks' then you're out of your mind. The fact of the matter is veterans get hosed more often than not. I dont need to regale this thread with my personal stories of friends who have come back from the desert with serious injuries and an even more serious need for psycological therapy, but believe me I got some doozies... and Im sure Im not the only one.

There arent enough benefits in the world to offer these kids, what's worse is that vets who have served multiple tours and gone on multiple missions are now either fighting to get the basic medical benefits they're entitled to or being stop lossed and sent back with no choice in the matter.

I dont see how anyone can question who deserves what. I guess it's so much easier to judge and question from the couch.

[mitchrock]

Funny how our government does not support our troops.

[seraphim]

I recently heard the argument that these money/education incentives to join the volunteer army is a method to leverage the poor to do the fighting for the rich. On top of that, in order to make certain this isn't the case, we should remove these incentives so the volunteer army isn't a mechanism for creating an under-class.

I am slowly adopting these beliefs. I believe we do a great disservice to the nation, as a whole, when we target the poorest people to make sacrifices that benefit the richest. Worst of all, the sacrifices they are making are possibly/probably their lives. Unfortunately, I also believe that the poor should be able to get an education, but I don't know if the GI BILL is the best/moral way to go about it.

I thought I'd throw this into the mix because it has gotten me thinking. I was indoctrinated with "Join the Army to get money for a college degree," and never questioned the implications of such a program. The more and more I think about it, the more I see how War-Profiteering, like Vietnam & Iraq, is allowed to happen.

I know it's the job of Generals and Senators and Presidents to make the tough choices in getting their soldiers killed. This isn't something they take lightly nor relish, but it is a part of their job duties. They don't specifically choose who they get killed by their decisions, but OUR policies certainly change the pool so it's probably the poor.

Is there a moral issue linking college/education to risking your life for your country? You shouldn't have to risk your life, for the rest of us, in order to go to school. Especially since I'm well off enough I don't even have to make that choice.

-_Sf

[SmytheKing]

Originally Posted by dgrycan

People should NOT have to serve for 12 years during a time of war in order to receive benefits from our government. Anyone who voluntarily completes one tour in my books deserve everything we can give them.

Seriously - isn't three years a long time to serve considering the time invested and the risk involved?

Not disagreeing at all. I don't know what an "acceptable" amount of time would be. I just want to point out that McCain isn't against it at all. No more than Obama is for voting against McCain's bill. McCain voted against that bill because he felt it wouldn't encourage people to stay in the military "long enough". Doesn't he have the right to feel that way without it being because he doesn't give a **** about the Vets?

To me it's the same as people calling Obama unpatriotic because he didn't put his hand over his heart while the national anthem was playing (and ignoring that he was singing it).

Originally Posted by Joe Hoya

Can't it be both?

Sure. I think that's fine. As long as the understanding is that you could go to war and be required to kill someone and that you're ok with that. Signing up for the armed forces SPECIFICALLY because of the benefits is not the best thing to do. If you want to serve the country (or its interests) and, as a result, you get those benefits. . .more power to you. I think too many people forget what the military is for.